fact checking and correcting RDI forumsforjustice.org re: JonBenet Ramsey forensic handwriting identification

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fact checking and correcting RDI forumsforjustice.org re: JonBenet Ramsey forensic handwriting identification

Post by redpill on Mon Apr 23, 2018 1:13 pm

Sleep  cherry

study

forumsforjustice.org claims to seek "justice" for  JonBenet Ramsey

forumsforjustice.org  FFJ Senior Member

koldkase wrote:
"Me, I can use my own eyes and I don't need no special training to see that Patsy wrote the note.
koldkase wrote:
"Patsy Ramsey wrote the note. Period. No question. No reasonable argument. All anyone who is objective has to do is compare her exemplars with the ransom note, not to mention the repeated, innumerable writings, statements, and interviews with the Ramseys which repeat excessively the language in the ransom note." -

so forumsforjustice.org is representing to the public they stand for justice, they want justice for Jonbenet

and their claim is that you can tell Patsy wrote it with your own eyes.

as I mention before,



similarly,


cherokee wrote:
My sentiments exactly.

In my humble opinion ... anyone (like Paula Woodward) who believes the Ramseys are innocent and would shill for them, after ALL the documented evidence otherwise, is either:

a. delusional

b. an idiot

c. corrupt

or

d. all of the above


this is the same Cherokee who claims her forensic handwriting and linguistics analysis, one that trica griffth cynic endorsed, prove Patsy wrote the ransom note. sadly, she deleted that thread. she deleted it before i had a chance to copy it, not realizing it would one day be gone forever. otherwise i'd post it.

Cherokee and all RDI forumsforjustice.org posters

this is a statement of justice as listed by Brent Turvey


Brent Turvey wrote:
Maintain an attitude of professionalism and integrity.
Conduct all research in a generally accepted scientific manner.
Assign appropriate credit for the ideas of others that are used.
Treat all information (not in the public domain) from a client or agency in a confidential manner, unless specific permission to disseminate information is obtained.
Maintain an attitude of independence and impartiality in order to ensure an unbiased analysis and interpretation of the evidence.
Strive to avoid preconceived ideas or biases regarding potential suspects or offenders from influencing a final profile or crime analysis when appropriate.
Render opinions and conclusions strictly in accordance with the evidence in the case.
Not exaggerate, embellish, or otherwise misrepresent qualifications when testifying, or at any other time, in any form.
Testify in an honest, straightforward manner and refuse to extend their opinion beyond their field of competence, phrasing testimony in a manner intended to avoid misinterpretation of their opinion.
Not use a profile or crime analysis (the inference of Offender or Crime Scene Characteristics) for the purposes of suggesting the guilt or innocence of a particular individual for a particular crime.
Make efforts to inform the court of the nature and implications of pertinent evidence if reasonably assured that this information will not be disclosed in court.
Maintain the quality and standards of the professional community by reporting unethical conduct to the appropriate authorities or professional organizations. (Turvey 1999: 722)

on this list let's look at these

Maintain an attitude of professionalism and integrity.

Conduct all research in a generally accepted scientific manner.

Maintain an attitude of independence and impartiality in order to ensure an unbiased analysis and interpretation of the evidence.

Render opinions and conclusions strictly in accordance with the evidence in the case.

Make efforts to inform the court of the nature and implications of pertinent evidence if reasonably assured that this information will not be disclosed in court.

let's revisit Cherokee's claim


cherokee wrote:
My sentiments exactly.

In my humble opinion ... anyone (like Paula Woodward) who believes the Ramseys are innocent and would shill for them, after ALL the documented evidence otherwise, is either:

a. delusional

b. an idiot

c. corrupt

or

d. all of the above


vs Brent Turvey

Maintain an attitude of professionalism and integrity.

Conduct all research in a generally accepted scientific manner.

Maintain an attitude of independence and impartiality in order to ensure an unbiased analysis and interpretation of the evidence.

Render opinions and conclusions strictly in accordance with the evidence in the case.

all 6 handwriting experts who studied the originals eliminated John Ramsey as the author.

using these criteria

Maintain an attitude of professionalism and integrity.

Conduct all research in a generally accepted scientific manner.

Maintain an attitude of independence and impartiality in order to ensure an unbiased analysis and interpretation of the evidence.

Render opinions and conclusions strictly in accordance with the evidence in the case.

the scientific forensic evidence is John Ramsey is eliminated as author. This of course blows DocG of solving jonbenet out of the water. his ideas are of a fringe crackpot with no scientific basis.


this is the conclusion of 2 of the 4 ABFDE experts hired by BPD who studied the ORIGINALS

Richard Dusak


  Dusak Findings. "Richard Dusick (sic) of the U.S. Secret Service concluded that there was "no evidence to indicate that Patsy Ramsey executed any of the questioned material appearing on the Ransom Note." (SMF P 200; PSMF P 200.)" (Carnes 2003:26, note 14).

  Qualifications. Dusak is a member of the American Board of Forensic Document Examiners. According to ABFDE: "The American Board of Forensic Document Examiners (ABFDE) is the only certifying board sponsored by the American Society of Questioned Document Examiners, the Canadian Society of Forensic Sciences, The Southeastern Association of Forensic Document Examiners, the Southwestern Association of Forensic Document Examiners, and is recognized by the American Academy of Forensic Sciences."


Edwin F. Alford, Jr.

Edwin F. Alford, Jr.

"Examination of the questioned handwriting and comparison with the handwriting specimens submitted has failed to provide a basis for identifying Patricia Ramsey as the writer of the letter."

on an ASTM scale of 1-9 where 9 is elimination, Richard Dusak & Edwin F. Alford, Jr. has eliminated Patsy Ramsey as the author.

RDI forumsforjustice.org posters Cherokee and koldkase represent to the public and to other RDI that Patsy wrote the ransom note, it's Patsy's handwriting.

koldkase wrote:
"Me, I can use my own eyes and I don't need no special training to see that Patsy wrote the note.
koldkase wrote:
"Patsy Ramsey wrote the note. Period. No question. No reasonable argument. All anyone who is objective has to do is compare her exemplars with the ransom note, not to mention the repeated, innumerable writings, statements, and interviews with the Ramseys which repeat excessively the language in the ransom note." -

and


cherokee wrote:
My sentiments exactly.

In my humble opinion ... anyone (like Paula Woodward) who believes the Ramseys are innocent and would shill for them, after ALL the documented evidence otherwise, is either:

a. delusional

b. an idiot

c. corrupt

or

d. all of the above


true justice includes following these guidelines

Maintain an attitude of professionalism and integrity.

Conduct all research in a generally accepted scientific manner.

Maintain an attitude of independence and impartiality in order to ensure an unbiased analysis and interpretation of the evidence.

Render opinions and conclusions strictly in accordance with the evidence in the case.

this is the conclusion of 2 of the 4 ABFDE experts hired by BPD who studied the ORIGINALS

Richard Dusak


  Dusak Findings. "Richard Dusick (sic) of the U.S. Secret Service concluded that there was "no evidence to indicate that Patsy Ramsey executed any of the questioned material appearing on the Ransom Note." (SMF P 200; PSMF P 200.)" (Carnes 2003:26, note 14).

Edwin F. Alford, Jr.


Edwin F. Alford, Jr.

"Examination of the questioned handwriting and comparison with the handwriting specimens submitted has failed to provide a basis for identifying Patricia Ramsey as the writer of the letter."

is  RDI forumsforjustice.org posters Cherokee and koldkase tricia griffith cynic et al following these guidelines esp

Render opinions and conclusions strictly in accordance with the evidence in the case.

when they claim Patsy wrote the ransom note, it's Patsy's handwriting, you can tell just by looking at it, it's Patsy's handwriting. anyone claiming Ramseys are innocent are idiot.

what would this criteria

Render opinions and conclusions strictly in accordance with the evidence in the case.

and


Maintain an attitude of professionalism and integrity.

Conduct all research in a generally accepted scientific manner.

Maintain an attitude of independence and impartiality in order to ensure an unbiased analysis and interpretation of the evidence.

in combination with this


Richard Dusak


  Dusak Findings. "Richard Dusick (sic) of the U.S. Secret Service concluded that there was "no evidence to indicate that Patsy Ramsey executed any of the questioned material appearing on the Ransom Note." (SMF P 200; PSMF P 200.)" (Carnes 2003:26, note 14).

Edwin F. Alford, Jr.


Edwin F. Alford, Jr.

"Examination of the questioned handwriting and comparison with the handwriting specimens submitted has failed to provide a basis for identifying Patricia Ramsey as the writer of the letter."

be regarding the question, is there evidence Patsy Ramsey wrote the ransom note based on forensic handwriting identification

is RDI forumsforjustice.org posters Cherokee and koldkase  truthfully representing the conclusions of expert witness conclusions on the forensic handwriting report when they claim, it's Patsy's handwriting.

Patsy wrote it.

that when the expert witness say


Richard Dusak


  Dusak Findings. "Richard Dusick (sic) of the U.S. Secret Service concluded that there was "no evidence to indicate that Patsy Ramsey executed any of the questioned material appearing on the Ransom Note." (SMF P 200; PSMF P 200.)" (Carnes 2003:26, note 14).

Edwin F. Alford, Jr.


Edwin F. Alford, Jr.

"Examination of the questioned handwriting and comparison with the handwriting specimens submitted has failed to provide a basis for identifying Patricia Ramsey as the writer of the letter."

they really mean, Patsy wrote the ransom note and if you disagree


cherokee wrote:
My sentiments exactly.

In my humble opinion ... anyone (like Paula Woodward) who believes the Ramseys are innocent and would shill for them, after ALL the documented evidence otherwise, is either:

a. delusional

b. an idiot

c. corrupt

or

d. all of the above


it should be clear that to investigative the Jonbenet Ramsey investigation using SCIENCE, actual real genuine science
the first question is, is there evidence John  Ramsey write the ransom note? expert witness testimony under Daubert is no, there is no evidence

is there evidence John  Ramsey write the ransom note? expert witness testimony under Daubert?

Maintain an attitude of professionalism and integrity.

Conduct all research in a generally accepted scientific manner.

Maintain an attitude of independence and impartiality in order to ensure an unbiased analysis and interpretation of the evidence.

Render opinions and conclusions strictly in accordance with the evidence in the case.



Richard Dusak


  Dusak Findings. "Richard Dusick (sic) of the U.S. Secret Service concluded that there was "no evidence to indicate that Patsy Ramsey executed any of the questioned material appearing on the Ransom Note." (SMF P 200; PSMF P 200.)" (Carnes 2003:26, note 14).

Edwin F. Alford, Jr.


Edwin F. Alford, Jr.

"Examination of the questioned handwriting and comparison with the handwriting specimens submitted has failed to provide a basis for identifying Patricia Ramsey as the writer of the letter."

Render opinions and conclusions strictly in accordance with the evidence in the case.

as an Justice IDI, true justice IDI, justice along the lines of


Maintain an attitude of professionalism and integrity.

Conduct all research in a generally accepted scientific manner.

Maintain an attitude of independence and impartiality in order to ensure an unbiased analysis and interpretation of the evidence.

Render opinions and conclusions strictly in accordance with the evidence in the case.

the conclusion to the question, is there evidence Patsy Ramsey wrote the ransom note, is no, there is no evidence Patsy wrote the ransom note, under Daubert. Patsy Ramsey is eliminated as the author.

Any DA or forensic scientist wanting to charge the Ramseys in court, will have to explain how they concluded Patsy or John wrote the ransom note when the expert witness say otherwise.

 RDI forumsforjustice.org posters Cherokee and koldkase superdave  tricia griffth, have been on this case long before i ever did, some of their posts date to 2001. in all these years they maintain Patsy wrote the ransom note, say so on forumsforjustice.org and claim some grave injustice is being committed.

the real injustice is in forusmforjustice's incompetence, scientific illiteracy, and ignorance.

forusmforjustice.org idea of "justice" is to disregard scientific expert witness testimony, proclaim Patsy Ramsey wrote the ransom note, and then claim that simply looking at Patsy's exemplars is enough, without any training, to see Patsy wrote it. This despite the fact actual genuine scientific research has shown time and time again lay persons without any training engage in overmatching. they see a couple of letters written by 2 different people and proclaim a match when there is none.

RDI posters superdave cherokee tricia griffth cynic koldkase et al at forumsforjustice and websleuth and reddit have never not once ever taken the time to make sure they understand the actual scientific literature on forensic documentation.

the ransom note, using scientific expert witness testimony, testimony that meets the Daubert Standard, is that an intruder came in the Ramsey home and wrote the ransom  note.

this summarizes forumsforjustice posters competence

koldkase wrote:
"Me, I can use my own eyes and I don't need no special training to see that Patsy wrote the note.

vs

 Dusak Findings. "Richard Dusick (sic) of the U.S. Secret Service concluded that there was "no evidence to indicate that Patsy Ramsey executed any of the questioned material appearing on the Ransom Note." (SMF P 200; PSMF P 200.)" (Carnes 2003:26, note 14).


Edwin F. Alford, Jr.

"Examination of the questioned handwriting and comparison with the handwriting specimens submitted has failed to provide a basis for identifying Patricia Ramsey as the writer of the letter."

and forumsforjustice claims that to follow this criteria

Maintain an attitude of professionalism and integrity.

Conduct all research in a generally accepted scientific manner.

Maintain an attitude of independence and impartiality in order to ensure an unbiased analysis and interpretation of the evidence.

Render opinions and conclusions strictly in accordance with the evidence in the case.

is


cherokee wrote:
My sentiments exactly.

In my humble opinion ... anyone (like Paula Woodward) who believes the Ramseys are innocent and would shill for them, after ALL the documented evidence otherwise, is either:

a. delusional

b. an idiot

c. corrupt

or

d. all of the above


Cherokee claims of the "documented evidence" but the actual documented evidence says exactly the opposite of what she claims.

and these results have been known at least since 2001

forumsforjustice and all RDI posters are nothing more than an anti-science lynch mob with no actual scientific understanding of the relevant scientific issues in evaluating forensic evidence.

Conduct all research in a generally accepted scientific manner.

this also applies on any and all FDE's like Cina Wong Tom Miller and Gideon Epstein et all who proclaim it's Patsy's handwriting.

are they expert witness under the daubert standard?

if forumsforjustice and all RDI posters really are interested in promoting justice for Jonbenet, they would tell the public the handwriting experts who meet the Daubert Standard have eliminated Patsy and John Ramsey as the author, therefore, the conclusion according to scientific standards of evidence and scientific reasoning on that evidence is that an intruder murdered Jonbenet Ramsey

forumsforjustice and all RDI posters  either have never heard of the daubert standard, or if they have, do not know how to apply it. nearly every book on forensic science, esp textbooks on handwriting lingusitics and even dna fiber trace, written post 2003 mention the daubert standard.

so the fact neither tricia griffth nor cynic nor koldkase nor superdave nor cherokee nor delmar england any RDI poster on any forum have never heard of the daubert standard tells you instantly  they have never studied the relevant forensic textbooks. they are making claims on subjects they have never at any time in their life ever studied in any capacity whatsoever.

i once told my old padawan superdave now furyofdragon if you only knew the power of the daubert side of the forensics.
the daubert side of the forensics is a pathway to many idi truths the rdi would consider to be unnatural.

would it be possible to learn this power?

not from an RDI

daubert is why burke and john ramsey will win or settle out of court a substantial amount of money with CBS. if you know what forensic document examiners actually do, based on science, and what CBS presented with their 2 fakes, you'd know CBS has no chance of winning. the 2 fakes claim the ransom note could have been written much shorter than it actually was. ok. therefore patsy wrote it. does not follow and conclusion contradicts expert witness who are qualified and are using scientifically accepted and tested methodology.

if cbs and cbs lawyers didn't already know what the daubert standard is, they will have a rude awakening when they discover nearly every single expert they presented in cbs case of will be ruled inadmissible under daubert. an fbi profiler is not an expert witness. claiming the ransom note could be shorter therefore patsy wrote it, is not expert witness.
No
you've been redpilled  cherry

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If you only knew the POWER of the Daubert side
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