The Unsolved Murder of JonBenet Ramsey
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People Magazine Investigates - Season 7 Episode 12 touch DNA and JonBenet

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 People Magazine Investigates - Season 7 Episode 12 touch DNA and JonBenet   Empty People Magazine Investigates - Season 7 Episode 12 touch DNA and JonBenet

Post by redpill Tue Sep 26, 2023 12:51 pm

Tue Sep 26, 2023 12:35 pm

I just watched

People Magazine Investigates - Season 7 Episode 12 -
Manhunt


episode summary

Manhunt Season 7 Episode 12 Episode Summary

Investigation Discovery delves into a chilling and unsolved crime from 2003 that shook a community to its core. This gripping episode unravels the harrowing story of a bank heist that escalated into a robbery-homicide, leaving a trail of devastation in its wake.

The episode chronicles the aftermath of this tragic event, where lives were shattered and families left to grapple with the unimaginable loss. Despite having the perpetrator’s picture and DNA, the authorities face a daunting challenge in tracking down the cold-blooded killer.

As the investigation unfolds, viewers will be taken on a journey through the relentless efforts of federal and local law enforcement agencies as they work tirelessly to solve the case. The episode sheds light on the complexities and frustrations that often accompany high-stakes manhunts, where every lead, clue, and piece of evidence becomes crucial in the pursuit of justice.

I plan to restrict this discussion as relevant to Jonbenet

this is a bank robbery resulting in 1 murder due to the gunman and bank robber shooting a guy with daughters because he refused to cooperate. on Aug. 12, 2003, at the Xerox Federal Credit Union on the Xerox campus. and murder of Raymond Batzel,

he was wearing gloves.

eye witnesses said they saw him bring in an umbrella, and then this umbrella was left the crime scene when the gunman fled.

they tested the umbrella for DNA in 2003

 People Magazine Investigates - Season 7 Episode 12 touch DNA and JonBenet   Vlcsn194
 People Magazine Investigates - Season 7 Episode 12 touch DNA and JonBenet   Vlcsn193

 People Magazine Investigates - Season 7 Episode 12 touch DNA and JonBenet   Vlcsn195

in 2003 DNA technology with the FBI they were unable to find a usable DNA profile on the umbrella

in 2011 DNA technology advanced and they used touch DNA and they were able to get a full DNA profile from the umbrella, the only DNA profile they were able to obtain from the crime scene but they had no suspects to match the DNA

now what is the value of touch DNA on an umbrella that eyewitness say the bank robber who was wearing gloves brought in?

let's ask RDI


does that DNA have any forensic value?

now this is RDI and forumsforjustice Tricia griffith


Suspect Tricia pictured below is an example of an anti-science denialist

 People Magazine Investigates - Season 7 Episode 12 touch DNA and JonBenet   08282010
 People Magazine Investigates - Season 7 Episode 12 touch DNA and JonBenet   Tricia10

this is what she claims

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?76520-Patsy-Ramsey/page92
tricia griffith wrote:
Anti-K, this whole forum has example after example after example that an intruder did not commit this crime.

No one can show one scintilla of evidence of an intruder.

As owner, I do my best to stay out of actual discussions about a crime.

The JBR case is the one expection.

Websleuths is a leader in true crime information as well as discussion. People come here to get information. It is imperative we deal with the facts. Not fantasy.

All I ask for are facts and a logical connecting of the dots. Logic and facts.

When I get time I will be going through the forum to make sure the JonBenet Ramsey forum is being held up to the high standards just like all our other forums on Websleuths.

The days of allowing anyone to post anything because it's part of their "theory" are gone. Facts and logic. Very simple.

this is her qualifications

Host Tricia Griffith is a veteran radio disc jockey and owner of Websleuths.com and owner of Forums for Justice.org.

in other words she has ZERO qualifications in forensic science. she has no training in forensic fiber, trace evidence, DNA yet she claims

tricia griffith wrote:
Anti-K, this whole forum has example after example after example that an intruder did not commit this crime.

No one can show one scintilla of evidence of an intruder.




similarly with Delmar England


delmar england wrote:
Letter to Boulder Colorado District Attorney, Mary Keenan

The crime scene consisted of an obviously bogus multi-page "ransom note" utilizing local materials. JonBenet's body was left in the basement of the Ramsey home with crude trappings falling woefully short of presenting a convincing kidnap\murder scene as it was intended to do. Even without pointing out more of a very long list of corroborating facts, the bogus note and inept staging is more than sufficient to isolate the perpetrators to the Ramsey household. Only a few minutes in examining and evaluating the evidence is required to reach this conclusion. It is impossible to reach any other conclusion on the facts. There was and is no evidentiary reason to look anywhere else. The only mystery to be solved was and is which Ramsey did what in relation to JonBenet's death.

Although it is not possible to reach any other conclusion from the evidence, it is possible to ignore the evidence and mentally invent "evidence" to take the place of truth and keep it hidden. Prompted by preconceived notions set in a context of money and political influence in conjunction with investigative cowardice and incompetence, this is precisely what has been going on for over six years.
delmar wrote:
Handwriting? Patsy has not been ruled out by several examiners. By my own analysis, not of the writing, but of the mind match between the note and Patsy is clear. This is explained in my analysis of the "ransom note." So far, neither you nor anyone else has quoted and challenged it. So, to say the handwriting does not match the Ramseys, thus all Ramseys are excluded as author, is just another arbitrary declaration without substance. Note the exclusion of Ramseys necessarily depends on the intruder idea of no factual substance.

DNA? So, it does not match the family. So what? Who does it match? Unknown? If unknown, how can it be known to connect to the crime and be "evidence?" If the source of this DNA were known, then factually connected to the crime scene, then it is evidence. Absence this, it is just more speculation that caters to intruder mental creation.

Does the DNA have to be connected to the crime? Could it not be from a benign source totally removed from the crime scene? Again, the alleged evidence evidences nothing except itself with no known connection to the crime. No outsider as perpetrator is required to explain the DNA since no connection is known as crime related.

The same is true for boot print, hairs, fibers, etc.. A close look into anyone's house would most likely turn up all sorts of things whose source were unknown whether there is a crime or not. To call something whose source and cause is unknown as evidence is to say it causal related while simultaneously saying cause is unknown, thus relationship unknown; more "negative evidence." If my recollection of high school Latin is correct, this could be called "ignotium per ignotius", the unknown by the more unknown.

This "Ramsey defense" "thinking" is a direct and absurd contradiction that is without limit. With this kind of "investigative latitude", I dare say that one could "prove" anything; or at least, convince the deluded self that he or she has done so. "negative evidence?" Surely, thou jest. I repeat: All known evidence is local.
delmar england wrote:
For every "could be", there is a "could be not", therefore, inconclusive until cause is known. Right? No thing is evidence until evidentiary cause is known. Right? Are we in agreement so far? If not, please point out what you think is my error in thinking, and why you think it is error.

A shoe print is found in the basement whose cause is unknown. It "could be" evidence of an intruder. "Could be not" is forgotten and "evidence" of an intruder is declared to be fact. There is a palm print with cause unknown; a rope with source unknown that "could be" something brought in by an intruder; an unidentified fiber, a baseball bat that "could have" been used by the intruder; a bit of dirt or leaves at a window well which "could have" been disturbed by an intruder. The list goes on and on and on.

This massive "evidence" stated to be more consistent with a theory of intruder than Ramsey guilt is hot air, nothing more than a string of unknowns verbally laced together on "could be", simultaneously divorced from the known, and declared to be much evidence of an intruder. Ridiculous to the max. No wonder no one will step forward and answer questions about alleged evidence of an alleged intruder. Its indefensible.

The beauty of truth is that it is consistent. Every fact is a complement of and blends with every other fact without contradiction. The presence of a contradiction is also the presence of error. Are we in agreement up to this point?



again this is tricia griffith


 People Magazine Investigates - Season 7 Episode 12 touch DNA and JonBenet   08282010
 People Magazine Investigates - Season 7 Episode 12 touch DNA and JonBenet   Tricia10

and delmar england


DNA? So, it does not match the family. So what? Who does it match? Unknown? If unknown, how can it be known to connect to the crime and be "evidence?" If the source of this DNA were known, then factually connected to the crime scene, then it is evidence. Absence this, it is just more speculation that caters to intruder mental creation.

Does the DNA have to be connected to the crime? Could it not be from a benign source totally removed from the crime scene? Again, the alleged evidence evidences nothing except itself with no known connection to the crime. No outsider as perpetrator is required to explain the DNA since no connection is known as crime related


The same is true for boot print, hairs, fibers, etc.. A close look into anyone's house would most likely turn up all sorts of things whose source were unknown whether there is a crime or not. To call something whose source and cause is unknown as evidence is to say it causal related while simultaneously saying cause is unknown, thus relationship unknown; more "negative evidence." If my recollection of high school Latin is correct, this could be called "ignotium per ignotius", the unknown by the more unknown.

This "Ramsey defense" "thinking" is a direct and absurd contradiction that is without limit. With this kind of "investigative latitude", I dare say that one could "prove" anything; or at least, convince the deluded self that he or she has done so. "negative evidence?" Surely, thou jest. I repeat: All known evidence is local.


are these statements true?

there were 2 black male suspects.

Touch DNA eliminated one suspect.

it was a 100% match to this person

 People Magazine Investigates - Season 7 Episode 12 touch DNA and JonBenet   25f91110

is touch DNA found on one location in an umbrella in the 2003 resulting in murder
evidence Richard Leon Wilbern committed the robbery and murder on Aug. 12, 2003, at the Xerox Federal Credit Union on the Xerox campus.

how does finding touch DNA on an umbrella compare with finding touch DNA on Jonbenet?

Suspect


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